16v Tu Into A 205

[johnrobertgordon 0]

Hi,

 

I have an engine sitting around which is a low milage 1.6 16v Tu engine from a peugeot 307. I am looking to purchace a base model 205 like a 1.1 look or something similar. I am going to run the engine on a set of bodies and kms managment.

A few things that have crossed my mind are engine mounts, gearbox and shafts. I am presuming that the box from the 1.1 will fit the 1600 engine so the shafts and hubs would be retained from the base car. However for better ratios I was looking at using an XS box, would the shafts and hubs still be ok with this box?

Also will the engine mounts from the 1.1 engine fit the 1600 lump from the 307? (as in top mount)

 

Thanks

John

[Jrod 7]

Personally i'd try and use the box thats on the engine.

 

Xs boxes cant handle the power that an XS makes properly so the extra is going to kill it very quickly.

[johnrobertgordon 0]

with it being out of a 307 it has a cable operated jobbie, sounds complicated.

[Jrod 7]

106 gti one then?

[Sandy 189]

You can modify the levers on the 307 box and re-work the lever to accept a cable round the front of the engine and through the hydraulic lever to a fabricated bracket. Which is how I'm using a C2 box on my 205. Most 1.1 and XS carb engine boxes don't have the necessary "window" for the crank sensor. The later boxes have thicker diff pins, which push the shafts out a bit, so you'll need to re-set the seals to suit.

 

You'd be well advised to ditch the comedy standard exhaust manifold and remove the oil filter housing to fit a conventional filter and Raceland or similar 4-2-1 manifold, bodged onto a 205 downpipe. You'll need the Iron block TU 205 engine mount for the right hand side and grind it to clear the belt cover, with great care. If your shell is pre 90, the right hand engine mount arm will need to be the pre-90 TU type.

 

ECU wise, establish where you'll be getting it mapped and discuss what ECUs they're prepared to set up before committing to buy a particular brand.

[johnrobertgordon 0]

In your mind sandy is all this really worth it. I know you have built one yourself, I would asume the engine and car are well suited together.

 

Also anyone know if my engine (1.6 16v tu 110bhp) is the same as the 106 gti or saxo vts, thought they had a little more power?

[d-9 0]

the 307 engine (TU5JP4 iirc) is very similar to the 106GTI/Saxo VTS engine (TU5J4 iirc), with bigger valves but milder cams. There was a lot of chat on the rallye reg about using these engines with VTS cams and a remap and I think they have a lot of potential, but as standard they arent as powerful as a 106GTI engine.

 

Personally think one of these engines would be cracking in a 205, Ive run one in my 106 for the last 3 years and its a brilliant engine, almost mi16 performance and perfect relability (the 106 has been stood for 6 weeks but I would bet money it'll start on the first turn of the key). If I was putting it in a 205 I doubt id bother with the cable shift/hydralic clutch and just fit a late 106 1.1 gearbox, the ratios are practically the same as the GTI and theyre usually in perfect condition. MA boxes have a reputation for dieing and Ive got a reputation for killing gearboxes, but didnt have any real problems, the 106 gearbox was a bit crunchy on 2nd when i got it but wasnt much worse 2 years later when I finally changed it because I wanted longer ratios.

[Sandy 189]

Time again I would have built an XSI or Rallye headed TU 8v on TBs for sure, it's more fun IMO. For more power, it has to be the XU which has heaps more power/torque potential and weighs the same in alloy block form and has the BE box of course. I have converted several TU engined 205s to BE boxes now too, which is a worthwhile route.

 

I guess the fact is, that if you have the engine already, there's alot of sense in using it. Swapping the valve springs and cams from a 106 GTI or VTS as Doug says is a good move. I've seen 160bhp from just my TB set up and a supersprint exhaust manifold on a standard 106GTI engine, so I would expect similar with VTS cams in this engine (that car has scored several 2nd/3rd places in class in the Castle Combe saloons in that spec). But a budget build TU 1.6 8v I set up around the same time, with a Shillaber head, Newman PH2 cam, homemade TBs on my inlet and Raceland manifold on a standard bottom end, made 5bhp more than that with a savagely sexual delivery, which I'd much prefer for fun use. The chap claimed he'd spent less than £2k all told.

[johnrobertgordon 0]

with a savagely sexual delivery,

 

haha, Sounds awsome.

 

My friend has a non sunroof base model and I have the engine sat here, so using these two Items saves us a lot of money. After a long chat on the phone last night we have decided to use the 16v lump with a standard bottom end some catcam 708's with nothing too serious dont to the head, just a clean up and a re seat. We have found a place where we can get a set of jenveys with an emerald in a kit which includes all required seonsors injectors etc and its fairly cheap. Going to take your advice on the raceland manifold and a local friend in the same car club as us builds exhausts and he will build us a system with down pipe to match the manifold.

 

With the throttle bodies we have a choice of body size, standard is 42 i think but there is an option for 45, I am asuming the 42's will do the job just fine?

 

We still are unsure as to what box to use, the base car comes with a 1.1 box which we may try to start with.

 

We start stripping the car this weekend and I will get some pictures taken and hopfully start a project thread on it.

Edited August 7, 2008 by johnrobertgordon

[Sandy 189]

Sounds like a plan. You'll need to change the valve springs to accomodate the 708s. 42mm bodies will be ideal. Find out what inlet manifold is supplied, if it's the Jenvey one for SF or ST bodies, then fine, it just needs porting to make it ideal. If it's the Chadil DCOE pattern manifold, I'd avoid it, it's an appalling design. Aim for an overall tract length from valve to trumpet mouth of around 340-360mm.