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NickR

Budget Big Brake Brainache

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Adi
just confuses things a little if the only figures we have to go off are disc height.

 

Deffo agree.......the reason I originally posted about this was in case someone had to try and get a 206 disc with 34mm offset instead of 34mm height. Like you say, it all depends on where you get them from.

I wasn't aware of the fact you were using the same catalogue.

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NickR

Well Ive phoned a few local scrappers... no 266mm brake setups, alone 283 ones.

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Guest birdii

Don't xantia's all have the handbrake on the front? Did the pad's on my dad's S plate and it did!

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Guest web

Yes xantias all have the front handbrake but nobody forces you to use it of course.

 

They have different sizes as well... 266, 283, 288.... all vented. I would advise against 288 though as they are rarish, hard to source replacement bits for. Also they might not fit inside common 15 inch wheels.

 

I have the 283 Xantia brakes myself - a straight bolt-on to my BX. Only thing is, the 15 inch ZX 16V wheels I had didn't fit over it. I was told 205 speedlines will JUST fit over 283's though, but no guarantees... anyway, I changed to 15 inch steel wheels off a 306 for the sleeper look, slapped on XM wheel covers to boot. Sold off the alloys to raise money for a worthy engine...

 

Xantia calipers will interchange between 266 and 283, even if they may be different sizes. 283 Xantia wagons have 57mm pistons, the 266 and 283 saloons run 54mm pistons. So I slapped base model saloon calipers (off a 266 car!) onto base model wagon discs (283) and pad holder plates (is that what you call yokes?). All obviously piece of cake to find in local yards. I used the smaller type pads as well ; leaves a slight bit of the disc unused but more leverage to the used part of the disc. Also they are much cheaper :wacko:

 

IMO for street use, performance pads and rotors are a band-aid fix for brakes that are actually too small. Fit big enough brakes and there is no need at all to fit 1144 pads, drilled rotors and all that fancy expensive stuff. I am sure 283's will stop a 205 with great authority even without any hi-po bits thrown at them. Modulation may even suffer if you do, especially on such a light car. It's not true that your brakes can never be too strong, especially if you don't have ABS (but even if you do).

 

Even on the heavier BX I feel no need to upgrade further although it does not have the engine power to match - YET. it only has a 1.9 8v GTI lump currently, 16v conversion (possibly with turbo) in the works.

 

Marcel

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C_W

I totally agree with you regarding replacing standard discs with drilled and grooved etc.

 

However the pad issue I don't; they will still fade just as easily (disc speed is actually high the bigger the disc too). So I would say a Mintex 1144 (or equiv) pad completes the setup properly.

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Super Josh
I totally agree with you regarding replacing standard discs with drilled and grooved etc.

 

However the pad issue I don't; they will still fade just as easily (disc speed is actually high the bigger the disc too). So I would say a Mintex 1144 (or equiv) pad completes the setup properly.

After just having fitted GTi-6 setup with 1144's, I would completely agre with Chris on this one. Just wish the bl@@dy pads would stop squeeling though :wacko:

 

 

Josh

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pacey205

Mine used to when I was bedding them in but theyve been fine for ages now.

 

Michael

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NickR

Im on my 4th set and not a squel, ive used 3 different types of disc as well.

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base-1
Well I know where a 307 283x26mm setup is lying for £120 including discs- this incidentally is the same setup as the 206GTi 180 according to Hilgie, and goes straight on a 205.

are they still there?!?!?! B)

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Guest web

Hmmm pad fade is a heat issue, not necessarily speed... and bigger brakes don't run nearly as hot, car and driving habits being equal.

 

I never fade my 283's with stock pads, and I thought I wasn't driving like a little old lady but maybe I am?? Used to fade the std fitment (266 solids) all the time.

 

Marcel

Edited by web

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C_W

I think it's a bit of both with the bigger discs; there are turning fast at the point of pad contact but at the same time there is extra leverage, and less need to "use them as much". So it probably balanced out more in favour of them NOT fading as much.

 

If you went to a track day they wouldn't last 2minutes on standard pads. I used a set up in 20minutes once.

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NickR

Bigger discs wont get as hot.

As well as what C W said, theres also the fact that disc is bigger so can absorb more heat energy, meaning the average temperate will be lower.

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Guest web

xactly and in my experience it's the only thing that really helps...

 

So given the (budgetary) choice of either hi-po pads/discs or one more size up but standard, I'd always go with the latter. I've tried both, and found that undersized brakes will always remain undersized no matter how much money you throw at them.

 

Sure, hi-po components may give a little extra bite and may take a little longer to start fading, but it still doesn't really cut it. So go big first, and maybe use the hi-po components as a finishing touch later.

 

Marcel

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C_W

Interestingly there is someone with a Clio Williams (the one that stands on its end! B) ) that runs the standard size brakes with plain discs but race pads and he reckons they are a good setup.

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Guest web

Clio Williams comes with 259mm vented discs from the factory, not extremely big but not what I'd call undersized either, for such a light little car

Edited by web

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Guest GROUP N PUG

So what was the conclusion to this debate? regarding which set-up was best in terms of price, ease of fitting, availibility and performance! Would we say the 306 GTI6 set-up was best? and if so would we could conclude that you do/don't need to swap the M/C? Also, i may be sounding thick here, but are the yolks the bit that join the calliper to the hub? does the GTI6 setup fit straight onto 205GTI hubs with the GTI6 yolks?

 

Cheers! B)

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NickR

GTi6 is a good setup, and if buying new parts, good value for money.

 

2nd hand gti6 stuff tends to be overpriced (new stuff can be got for only a little more), the various 266mm setups are a better option as found on lesser spec models that Scrap Yards wont charge a premuim for. The 307 brakes are worth looking out for in scrap yards as they again are not fitted to sporty models and are definatly as good as gti6 setup (for same size).

 

Atleast a 22.2mm Master Cylinder is needed for either of the above setups as the std front sliders pm the caliper are 48mm and the 266mm setup is 54mm which is quite a jump, gti6 setup uses 57mm sliders, 307 brakes 54mm. IMHO the 22.2mm MC will suffice.

 

I think the best thing to do is set a budget. And see what the best setup you can get for your budget is, see what available new, 2nd hand ect.

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Guest GROUP N PUG

The thing I'm most stuck on is what will fit and what won't!!!

 

If I went for a 306 2L set-up which has the 266mm discs, and 54mm pistons in the calliper, and the 22.2mm M/C (all according to brakepart.co.uk) will this all bolt straight on to my 1.9 GTI?

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NickR

Yes it will.

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Guest GROUP N PUG

will i need the 306 yolks then?

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pug_ham

Yes, to be sure it all fits right.

 

Graham.B)

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Guest GROUP N PUG

where do i get them from then, as no-one seems to advertise them?

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pug_ham

Search any local scrapyards or use an on-line parts finder.

 

Graham.B)

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