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artois7

Mi16 Back To Standard

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artois7

Hi all,

 

Had a search around but can't find a thread quite similar.

 

I currently have a phase 2 1.9 with an mi16, 309 beam, stainless exhaust etc.

 

I also have a phase 1 1.6 in pieces.

 

My end goal would be to return the phase 2 back to being a 1.9 GTI, selling it and keeping the mi16 to put in the phase 1.

 

What parts would be interchangeable, and what do I definitely need to go and buy?

 

Need to buy:

 

  • 1.9 engine
  • 1.9 AFM / dizzy / other ignition bits?
  • Wiring loom?

I would keep the exhaust and manifold from the mi16. The 1.6 still has a complete exhaust but I assume these are different from 1.6 / 1.9. I would keep the be1 1.6 box for use with the mi16, and I believe the mi16 is mated to a 1.9 box (is there a way to verify?) currently so that wouldn't be an issue.

 

Am I going to face any issues with the wiring loom returning the phase 2 back to a 1.9 engine? Or with adapting the phase 1 loom?

 

The stainless exhaust has a life time receipt and I have faith in the mi16 engine so I'm reluctant to just sell the phase 2 as is and hunt down another mi16 - feel like I'm better off sticking with a known engine.

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Anthony

The main sticking point is wiring, as a Ph1 and Ph1.5/2 are quite different in terms of engine wiring. It can be adapted, but it's a reasonable amount of work.

 

If they don't come with the engine, you'll need the 1.9 specific engine management, injection and ignition parts.

 

Most of the other parts will interchange, but wouldn't necessarily be correct for the age of car depending how "standard" you want it to be - the Ph1 coil for example is wing mounted whereas it's inlet mounted on a Ph2, and the Ph1 exhaust is 3-piece whereas the Ph2 is 2 piece. The beam will swap, but obviously 1.6 is drum and 1.9 should be disk, front hubs/driveshafts/brakes are different between the two, etc.

 

The most obvious question though is why? Strikes me as a pretty sizeable amount of work to swap all that over and then build back up again and I'm not sure what the gain is at the end of it, unless you especially want a Ph1 205?

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welshpug

if its a good phase1 with all the period correct bits I would certainly leave it well alone, as its potentially worth a lot more to the right market.

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artois7

The main sticking point is wiring, as a Ph1 and Ph1.5/2 are quite different in terms of engine wiring. It can be adapted, but it's a reasonable amount of work.

 

If they don't come with the engine, you'll need the 1.9 specific engine management, injection and ignition parts.

 

Most of the other parts will interchange, but wouldn't necessarily be correct for the age of car depending how "standard" you want it to be - the Ph1 coil for example is wing mounted whereas it's inlet mounted on a Ph2, and the Ph1 exhaust is 3-piece whereas the Ph2 is 2 piece. The beam will swap, but obviously 1.6 is drum and 1.9 should be disk, front hubs/driveshafts/brakes are different between the two, etc.

 

The most obvious question though is why? Strikes me as a pretty sizeable amount of work to swap all that over and then build back up again and I'm not sure what the gain is at the end of it, unless you especially want a Ph1 205?

 

The beams and all running gear I was going to leave alone - stick with the 1.6 beam and running gear and leave the 309 beam on the phase 2.

 

There are a few reasons behind it. I love my phase 1 - It's simple. No electric windows, no central locking, the shell is really solid (inner wings are perfect!). I much, much prefer the interior and phase 1 dash. To me a 205 needs to scream 80's and I just don't get that retro vibe/feel from my phase 2. Does that make sense?

 

Also, realistically, I don't need two 205s. Going down this route will leave me the phase 1 with the mi16, and able to sell on a more or less standard phase 2 1.9, freeing up cash for the next project / toy.

 

 

if its a good phase1 with all the period correct bits I would certainly leave it well alone, as its potentially worth a lot more to the right market.

 

It's certainly not a bad phase 1, however it has been repainted at some point I believe (not the best job) and has an aftermarket sunroof, which pretty much kills all "original" resale value.

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welshpug

aftermarket sunroof is a very minor point, after all you can change the roof skin.

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artois7

aftermarket sunroof is a very minor point, after all you can change the roof skin.

 

I guess. That said, I intend to stick with the 1.6 running gear, interior etc etc. The only thing subject to change is the engine and a modified wiring loom. Nothing massively stops it being returned to original? Unless I'm missing something.

 

Given that I would have no intention or need to sell the phase 1 after doing this, I would be more concerned with resale value of the 1.9.

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Anthony

Fair enough, if it's just the engine and related bits you're swapping then it's a much simpler job.

 

I guess I can understand wanting an early car, especially given you've owned it for a few years - Phase 1's aren't for me but I can understand why people prefer them, same with the back to basics no mod-cons thing. I'm probably not the best person to comment on the not needed multiple 205's part :lol:

 

The only other potential gotcha I can see with your proposed plan is that some early BE1 gearboxes don't have a hole for the crank sensor which you'll need, but that's easy enough to check.

 

If you do go down that route and need help adapting the Mi16 loom so that it'll work in a Phase 1 feel free to give me a shout and pop over.

 

As for value, I think that depends which end of the market you're selling to - at the lower end, it's all about condition IMO.

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artois7

Fair enough, if it's just the engine and related bits you're swapping then it's a much simpler job.

 

I guess I can understand wanting an early car, especially given you've owned it for a few years - Phase 1's aren't for me but I can understand why people prefer them, same with the back to basics no mod-cons thing. I'm probably not the best person to comment on the not needed multiple 205's part :lol:

 

The only other potential gotcha I can see with your proposed plan is that some early BE1 gearboxes don't have a hole for the crank sensor which you'll need, but that's easy enough to check.

 

If you do go down that route and need help adapting the Mi16 loom so that it'll work in a Phase 1 feel free to give me a shout and pop over.

 

As for value, I think that depends which end of the market you're selling to - at the lower end, it's all about condition IMO.

 

:lol: agreed. Good to know about the gearbox. I've become quite attached to the phase 1, but never really connected with the red phase 2 in the same way. I'd love to just buy a rotten donor car to get everything I need, but that's exactly how I ended up with two 205s in the first place....

 

In all fairness, value is definitely not a priority. I have relatively little tied up in both cars, and neither car is ever going to command a huge price tag.

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