Tu Timing Help!

[miamichris 9]

Following on from my other topic, I need some help setting the timing on my tu3s engine, as its doing my head in.

 

Before this it was running well..My bro changed the cambelt but after locking the flywheel the camshaft pulley timing hole was facing 12 0'clock instead of 2 o'clock, which makes the timing 10 teeth out?

 

Remembered that the guy who sold me the car said there may be a high lift cam in it but couldn't prove it, so would that explain the timing being so far out? So we decided to put the pulley to the 2 o'clock (standard) position and lock it in place, fitted the belt etc. and started it up last night. It ran ok but misfired a bit and felt gutless trying to drive up the road, wouldn't rev freely when driving.

 

So tonight we've put the timing back to where it originally was but it won't even start up now?

 

Any ideas/suggestions welcome, need someone that knows about these engines as I know nothing about them and just can't work this one out

 

I need out of this garage, too many nights spent working at this car!

[swordfish210 20]

The ignition timings probably all to cock. Set the pulleys where they should be then get the engine warmed up. Once the engine is warm and idiling, slacken off the distributor bolts and slowly rotate the distributor forwards and backwards until you find the point wherre the idle engine speed is the highest. Bolt the distributor back down there and then reset the idle speed and try it like that.

[miamichris 9]

The ignition timings probably all to cock. Set the pulleys where they should be then get the engine warmed up. Once the engine is warm and idiling, slacken off the distributor bolts and slowly rotate the distributor forwards and backwards until you find the point wherre the idle engine speed is the highest. Bolt the distributor back down there and then reset the idle speed and try it like that.

 

Ok thanks Swordfish, i'll give it a go and let you know how I get on!

[miamichris 9]

Right, i'm at the end of my tether with this car, it is slowly destroying my soul

 

Heres the problems..

 

1. It runs like sh*t, sounds like a bag of spanners. Won't idle at all, if you take your foot off the accelerator it dies.

2. Its running, all be it very badly, with the ignition leads in reverse (ie. 1is where 4 is and 2 is where 3 is etc.) but not in the normal positions and I don't know why?

3. It will not rev freely. Again, don't know why.

4. It ran before, so why won't it run now?

 

So something is wrong and for the life of me I can't figure out what. I've doubled checked everything, changed parts, you name it i've done it.

 

New distributor cap, plugs, leads, rotor arm, new battery, carb stripped and cleaned out, cambelt set about 300 times, tried advancing/retarding the distributor , probably more stuff but can't think.

 

Any ideas??

[miamichris 9]

Here's the answer I think...

No.1 inlet valve is bent!!

I'm actually quite happy about this because at least now I have a direction to go in, heads off and on the bench. May be able to get a second hand head from a mate of my brothers, hopefully just drop that on and all the problems will be fixed!

 

My theory is that someone timed the engine wrong before and bent the valve and so knocked the timing back to make it run and sell it, probably to me ah well, you win some you lose some I suppose, shouldn't be too hard to sort out now I know what's wrong

[djinuk 2]

whilst the head is off might be worth getting the valves lapped in, maybe even a bit of a skim ..

 

I did the above and it made the world of diff to my tired xs

[miamichris 9]

Yeah, turned out 6 valves were bent!

 

So...the head got dropped round to my engine man today so he can check the valve guides and seats, if they need done he's going to do them.

 

Have a full new set of inlet and exhaust valves, a head gasket set and new head bolts sitting in the garage for it

 

Getting the head back tomorrow. The new valves will get lapped in, all the gaskets changed and i'll hopefully have it built this weekend! Can't wait to get it on the road, this has turned into a second project ffs!

[miamichris 9]

Head is rebuilt and back on the car now and its all back together again, got that sorted yesterday

 

Seems to run well, only problem is that its down on power. It revs freely when its parked, but when driving it doesn't seem to want to and its mis firing sometimes. I think its down to the ignition timing not being set right, going to have a play with it today and also try a spare distributor and coil on it just in case one of them is at fault.

 

Could do with gettting my hands on a timing light to check the timing properly but I haven't got one!

[miamichris 9]

Now has new ignition amp and changed the coil for a spare, no difference, still doesn't run right

 

When standing still it will rev quite happily and idle fine, but when I try to drive the revs die down and there's a lack of power, it drives but really slow!?

 

Checked the engine timing and i'm nearly sure its ok, when the engine is locked with the pins in though, the rotor arm points to no.4 ht lead, should it not point to no.1? I have the order correct, 1-3-4-2 anticlockwise with no.1 being top left on the distributor cap (looking down on it), can't understand what's wrong!

[welshpug 1,626]

you do know that Number 1 is flywheel end right?

[enduro 0]

Now has new ignition amp and changed the coil for a spare, no difference, still doesn't run right

 

When standing still it will rev quite happily and idle fine, but when I try to drive the revs die down and there's a lack of power, it drives but really slow!?

 

Checked the engine timing and i'm nearly sure its ok, when the engine is locked with the pins in though, the rotor arm points to no.4 ht lead, should it not point to no.1? I have the order correct, 1-3-4-2 anticlockwise with no.1 being top left on the distributor cap (looking down on it), can't understand what's wrong!

yes when the crank and cam are timed up you do find the rotor arm pointing to number 4 ht lead, thats how it is, thats how it always will be. you just cant get it any different no matter how many times you time it up, theres only one crank tdc and theres only one timing mark (the hole) on the cam, the distributor only fits one way and thats with the rotor arm pointing to number 4! anyway if it was 180 out it wouldnt run so thats not your problem. does raise the question tho..is number one cylinder really at the flywheel end?

[welshpug 1,626]

yes...

[enduro 0]

yes...

but could there be a different reason as to why that is than what we understand it to be? maybe for reference or identification purposes, because it certainly isnt when the crank and cam are lined up. line your marks up, whip your distributor cap off and the rotor arm will point to number four.

[miamichris 9]

Yeah I knew no.1 was at the flywheel end.

 

The good news is that I got it fixed tonight!! It really does go now, very quick for a 1.4!

 

So the problem was..theres TWO holes in my flywheel! I went over and over everything and checked this on the off chance, so basicaly i'd timed the engine on this second hole and so it was firing too early I think. Shouldn't have done any damage though because I alwways turned it over by hand first.

 

All I can say is thank f**k thats over and I hope my gti doesn't give me as much bother when I get it built up!

 

Thanks for all the help, took it out for a spin there and I officialy love 205's again

 

Cheers! Chris

[miamichris 9]

but could there be a different reason as to why that is than what we understand it to be? maybe for reference or identification purposes, because it certainly isnt when the crank and cam are lined up. line your marks up, whip your distributor cap off and the rotor arm will point to number four.

 

This is what I couldn't understand, I thought it should point to no.1 but I suppose it makes sense if the cylinders are numbered back to front!

[miamichris 9]

Here's a photo of the car that gave all the hassle to end this topic!

 

[Casanova 0]

Nice XS!